Corroborating Frank Watts (aka "Frank Withers")


#1

If anyone here is on Registry.com or some other ancestral database, can you look up FRANK WATTS for us?
How do modern day databases record the life of our beloved Frank Watts, assimilated by Seth long before the Borg?
Has anyone done historical checking on Seth’s historic recollections using modern technology, name searches, and maps?

~ Dear Seth Talks: do we have a Database we can build here?


#2

Sounds fascinating! My sis and I are into genealogy, and I love doing research, so I’ll see what I can find.


#3

Ok, I did a little checking, and was able to find a Frank H. Watts that died in 1942. There wasn’t any other info without subscribing to Ancestry.com. My sis has a subscription, but she is really busy right now. I’ll ask her to check on it when she gets a chance. This is a pic of the one that I found, but it might not be the right one. The dates that he gave, and names of family members, could be distortions.


#4

There does not seem to be any other coordinated research on Seth-Ruburt, other than us.
Someday we will have an archive to store this information publicly.
Until then, this is a nice path.


#5

See my new thread called “HELP…” We can’t fund research but we can connect the dots–what Seth said years before science–epigenetics, probabilities…


#6

I’ve tried several times on Ancestry, but tried again just now. I can find no Frank or Francis Watts nor Ursula Watts in Elmira, NY. I’m wracking my brain to see if I remember anything saying Frank Watts was a pseudonym to ensure his family’s privacy, but no luck so far. Does anyone recall that? Where?
Correction: I can find no Frank Watts who was a teacher married to an Ursula in Elmira.


#7

I have found Jane and Rob and his brother Loren.


#8

“Frank Withers” appears in the early books; “Frank Watts” is the real name.


#9

There was a later desire to hide the real identity…ron


#10

ok im looking at tes book 1 and here goes:

born 1885
wife born 1888
frank died 1942
wife died in 1954
frank was 74 when he died
Franks’ wife was 75 when she died
at the time of the session frank had been dead for 32 years
(Frank’s math doesn’t add up, lol, They don’t call him on it so that might have been a missed opportunity for clarification. Frank does say that he doesn’t experience time where he is so that might account for his numbers being off?)
Frank’s wife’s name was Ursula Torto
Frank had 3 children: Doris, Saros and Edward
Saros died at the age of 3
at the time of the session in 1963 both Edward and Doris were alive
Doris is the eldest
Frank was born in a house on State Street, but not in Elmira.
The address is 243 State Street
In 1963 a man named Sam Towson was living there
Frank and Sam knew one another. They were friends
Sam’s profession was in medicine before he retired

franks daughter doris lived in schenectady and is married to a doctor
sam towsons’s son is doris’s husband.
doris’s husbands first name is dick
in 1963 their address is 2427 guippy street
Tim is franks grandson but he seems to indicate that tim was from an earlier marriage of doris
there is also a sally and patricia, both grandchildren but he doesnt specify the parents.

Doris was married twice (as of 1963). 1st marriage ended in divorce but it doesnt state if Dick is the 1st or second husband.
frank says he spent most of his time in elmira but was born in a house on state street, and state street wasnt in elmira. as of 1963, when the session happened, the state street address was still standing. frank taught english for 34 years at a grade school in elmira. so that might account for his spending most of his time in elmira but not living in elmira?

Keep in mind, doris could be short for dorothy. Dick for richard. Ed for edward or eddie. These might also be middle names or names that frank called them when they were alive but might not be their legal names. Since doris was married twice (as of 1963) her name would have changed 3 times. Her birth name, her first married name and her second married name. Since this was in 1963 she might have gotten divorced again after this session and remarried.

Hope this helps. @clark


#11

also keep in mind, Frank could have worked in elmira, NY and lived in PA. Also in 1963 doris lived in Schenectady so she could have easily moved to neighboring states at a later time when she died. Keep that in mind when searching death records.

when giving the address is schenectady frank paused and then said “Train” and they confirmed he meant to say train but then nothing else connected to that followed.

Also there is apparently the city of elmira and the town of elmira according to wiki.


#12

Thanks. The first thing I did was pull out TES 1. I’ve found nothing. I haven’t checked his children yet.
I’m reminded of my great grandfather, the first of my line named Clark Center. His life was very well documented by business and political records from 1850 to his death in 1914. It was only by accident that I found two deeds in a state in which he did not live which he signed Jeremiah Clark Center. In short, this may take a while. :slight_smile:


#13

A quick Google maps search shows that there’s a State Street in Schenectady. Although Frank doesn’t say he lived there, he says his daughter does / did. A clue perhaps? Maybe they both lived there at one time?

Here’s 243 State Street, looks like a rough neighbourhood! It seems to be a combined residential / commercial building though, so it could fit with where Frank was born. It looks old enough. Maybe ‘Sam Towson’ had some kind of surgery or clinic on the ground while living above it?

No Guippy Street shows up anywhere but I’m inclined to think that was a psychic typo :wink:


#14

Another clue - Saros is a word of apparently Greek origin, and Ursula Torto also seems to be a Greek or Italian name, so there’s a good chance that Franks wife’s family were of Greek or maybe Italian extraction. I like this detective work!


#15

Yes, Frank does say his wife’s nationality is Italian and his is English


#16

Frank might also be short for Francis or Franklin too

Or Frank might have just been confused and didn’t know his elbow from his asshole, lol. Jane’s abilities were also developing then too so crossed wires could be to blame. They should have asked Seth to give them more information when he started to come through, but I guess they’d have no way of knowing that the information Frank was giving them wasn’t on point.

I think they did ask Miss Callahan and she remembered him.

A good exercise is to try to find information about miss callahan herself, since we know she was a living person and we know where she lived and when. From there we might be able to use those same tools to find frank or his family.

Im having a hard time trying to find any info on her online, lol


#17

Think I’ve turned up something on Miss (Florence) Callahan:

http://archiver.rootsweb.ancestry.com/th/read/PABRADFO/2001-06/0991780816

18th line, descendants of Daniel Callaghan:

3 Mary Florence Callahan b: July 10, 1889 d: March 08,
1968 Burial: Sts. Peter and Paul, Elmira, NY , Occupation: English Teacher at Southside High School

This fits, right? Seems to be around the right birth / death dates, and it says she was an English teacher.

If she knew Frank Watts and he was an English teacher in Elmira then he almost certainly would have taught at Southside High School as well. So if there was a staff list for that school for the right time period…we’d be getting pretty close!

Correction: Frank was an elementary school, not a high school teacher, so he wouldn’t have taught at the same school. Progress anyway!


#18

Haven’t checked but as I recall it Miss Callaghan didn’t remember Frank, but he remembered her. She taught his kids.


#19

Hmmm, i wonder then if she taught them in high school or grade school. If she taught them in high school then we would now know where they went to school.


#20

@Martin I found this by googling her name along with southside high school. Seems like she wrote this. http://www.tandfonline.com/doi/pdf/10.1080/00335634609381194

I love how adding 1 piece of info in a search opens up a bunch of other important info.