And she’s waiting within your soul. – ron
Let me revise that date of Rob’s 100th birthday event, it was 2019, and not 1999, sorry, not fully awake then. Thanks, ron.
@barrie & @ron: It must’ve been a great experience to attend Jane Roberts’ Seth gatherings. I wonder if you realized it at the time, or later when you read the Seth material too.
Ron was in Jane’s probable ESP class in Miami, FLA. To explain, in the 1960s, when Jane and Rob stopped in Miami on their way back to Elmira after visiting with Jane’s father, who had a camper in Marathon, in the Keys, they both fell in love with the climate, and considered relocating to Miami, however, they returned to Elmira. Seth came through later and gave them detailed information about their probable life in Miami when they did move from Elmira to Miami, that Rob found good work as an artist and Jane got a good job in a museum, and they bought a house not far from where I lived in Miami, and when Jane launched, via a newspaper ad, her ESP class sessions, Ron, in his 20s, got wind of it because he had a keen interest in ESP, and psychic exploration, and he became Jane’s class photographer, all in this PROBABLE reality where our realities crossed paths. The official reality was different, but Seth was well aware of Jane and Rob in Miami.
Inavalan, Ron was never in Seth’s class in Elmira.
…ron speaks…Please pay close attention here.
When Seth commented on the overpopulation problem in 1970, in session 550, some 50+ years ago, the then world population was 3,700,000,000. Today in 2021, the world population is 8,000,000,000+ and growing exponentially.
Additionally, Seth mentioned in the material that overpopulation is a “violation.” Seth also mentioned that killing was a violation.
From Seth Speaks, Session 550, for Sept. 28, 1970.
Seth: The overpopulation problem will teach you that if you do not have a loving concern for the environment in which you dwell, it will no longer sustain you – you will not be worthy of it."
Once more, briefly, I have it from my dream teachers in Seth University, Dream Campus – my characterization, the population of earth will be curtailed and reduced in future generations, and not by war, disease or geological upheaval, but rather without fanfare, when women, yes, the women, who dream/share in FrameWork Two, will unite their consciousnesses with the global solution, thus becoming sterile for one to two generations as necessary, and population attrition will quickly reduce the population from 9 billion down to 3 to 4 billion.
And upon the adequate reduction, women will, once again, become fertile, and will give birth to a revolutionary new generation of kids who will fully mature by age ten, and they will automatically make use of their innate ESP powers of communication, mental communication, thus obsoleting the need for exterior, physical methods of communication, for example, by devices, and religion, science and government will be in sharp decline as being no longer relevant and no longer in control, and the shift in consciousness, or Renaissance Two, the new world order, will be in full swing. All this will be in place by year, 2075, or sooner depending on the direction mass consciousness takes.
The old religions will be replaced by new directions of thought as given by Speakers who will, once more, appear and begin enlightening masses as to the infinite power of human creativity and potential and putting them in touch with their inner selves and inner senses, and their “gifts of the gods.” Equality and peace will reign. 2075.
I’m happy to report that I awoke this morning at 4AM from my nightly dream adventures in Seth University, Dream Campus – my characterization for the dream platform where no-name teachers continue the ENDLESS material, with a poem that Jane/Ruburt inspired me to give, as she welcomes people to visit her world view and the god of Jane in the dream State. Here it is.
On the outskirts
of reality
was your last stop
school house earth?
Had enough…yet?
You may jump off
if you’re ready
for star hopping
but if not
you’re welcome back
let’s play
and have FUN!
And along the way
we’ll hold hands
and pray, for
we’ll love our stay.
– a dream poem by Ronald H. Card
I’m also happy to report that a while back, I submitted a poem to a national poem contest, and was accepted and my poem was published in a poetry book. It is…
The Wizard Within – by Ronald H. Card
We’re off to see the Wizard
in the playground of the soul.
Clicked me heels three times together
and Magic began to flow.
Our lives are written in the stars,
so let your magic flow,
for the Wizard within will help you,
Barrie, Guess what? I have considerable Seth material dictated by Jane that you are not aware of. I have a number of NEVER BEFORE PUBLISHED material sessions, that is, no book reference as these sessions fell through the cracks between two Seth books in 1975. When I met with Laurel Davies-Butts in 2014, to obtain Rob’s 1968 Seth portrait, yes, the same painting that hung on the wall at 458 in Elmira that you gazed upon when you attended the ESP class sessions, she gave me as a gift, Rob’s transcript volume #18, which Laurel pointed out to me had UNIQUE, unpublished sessions, some dozen sessions with topics like Christ and Atlantis to name a couple. In addition, breaking news for you, I recently obtained more unpublished Seth and Jane and Rob and Laurel material, that is, original Jane and Rob artwork, journals, letters, photos, gifts, when I drove up to Elmira and obtained from the woman who cleaned out Laurel’s abandoned, left-behind material at the Hill house at 1730 Pinnacle Road in Elmira when she sold the house to this lady because Rob had passed and Laurel owned three houses and had to sell the Hill house–because it was condemned by the city of Elmira as no longer to be occupied due to its run down condition, and this woman, who lives in Pine City, NY, about 7 miles SW of Elmira, bought the Hill house in 2010 and sold it in 2014, actually, her husband is a building contractor and he tore the old house down and built a new house on the lot and she sold that house. But before the Hill house was demolished, she went through it and salvaged, retrieved a car FULL of Seth, Jane, Rob and Laurel material! She saw the big feature in the Elmira newspaper on the open house of The Seth House at 458 by the two girls who have set up the Seth House non-profit foundation, to eventually purchase and restore it as a future focal point for Seth studies and Seth Museum and Conference Center, and she got in touch wil Kate and Oshara, and informed them that she was sitting on considerable material she removed from the Hill house and she wanted to know if anyone would be interested in the extensive material, because she did not know much about Jane and Rob and Seth, but realized that what she salvaged was important in spiritual terms, so Kate and Oshara told this woman that Ron Card would be very interested in what she saved, and they gave me the lady’s phone number, and I got in quick touch with her, and we came to agreeable terms for me to drive up to Elmira-Pine City, and purchase the material and take it off her hands, that being Nov. of 2020. All this is photographed on Facebook for all to see. I was blown away by what Laurel abandoned at the Hill house, although she did transfer most of the material to the new house that she and Rob purchased on Vallilee Place in Sayre, PA, ( besides 404 Olive St, house in Sayre) and they closed on the new, big house, and before they could move in, Rob gets deathly sick and dies in 2008, leaving Laurel very stressed out and with little money and her only income was royalties from Rick Stack on the Seth books, and other publishes as well. When I returned home here in VA, and unpacked my car which was STUFFED with the Hill house material, I was simply blown away, over 25 original Jane Roberts artwork and also Rob’s oil painting of his “Italian Woman!” and dozens of Rob sketches, and, Jane and Rob’s 300 volume personal library of books, some signed philosophy books, etc., and owned by Walt Zeh while in college with Jane!!! Dozens of personal letters! So, I have an amazing Stehian treasure trove of stuff that I’ll be going through for months ahead and discovering TONS of Sethian easter eggs! Also, something AMAZING that I came across that only Laurel knows, and now me, and i have the original material here, and that is, on January 20th, 1986, Laurel and Rob documented a short session using THE Ouija board, whereby Seth came through the board and gave very revealing information, including about Jane and Malba. I have blockbuster Seth information that I must sit on for the time being. You might also like to know that when I displayed my extensive Seth Museum Collection at the Seth House for Rob’s 100 birthday celebration event in summer of 1999, I brought along THE Ouija board–that I had obtained from Laurel in 2015, and me and Kate and Oshara played it in Jane and Rob’s apartment #5, and Seth came through and identified himself and we had a short session, that we documented in text and photos, and Seth told us that he and Jane and Rob were well aware of what we were doing with the Seth House and were very pleases with our plans to preserve it for future generations of Seth-minded people. So, Seth–and his WE ARE SETH family of teachers is, as we know, alive and well, and he will communicate when invited through the Ouija board, and Rob and Jane can also be contacted as well, for research purposes, and I have THE Ouija board right here under wraps awaiting future use. There are exciting times ahead for the expansion of the endless material, and I have risen to the occasion as a volunteer. – ron, who hosts, SETH FORCE - The Adventure in Consciousness Continues, on Facebook.
Ron Writes: What you (Barrie) are saying is that you, Barrie, control the future, and you control Seth’s future.
Barrie Responds: No, I am not saying that all. Are you saying that about yourself? I AM saying what Seth, Jane and Rob actually said on the topic of Seth only communicating via Jane in order to maintain the authenticity and integrity of the Seth material…and to avoid great distortion.
Ron Continues: There’s a lot you missed and ignored with the Seth material, out of your own ego making.
Barrie Responds: I’m glad you have deemed yourself an expert on me and what I have missed and ignored because of my ego. In any case, Jane, Seth and Rob did say what they said. It is not my words; it is theirs.
Ron Continues: Seth wears a guise, or, in terms of 2021, a 'folter" and he wears many guises and he has always been a teacher and will always be a teacher and is now in…Seth University, Dream Campus, where his family of consciousness, that is, Seth’s brother and sister counterparts–aspects also teach the endless material and they can go by different names.’
Barrie Responds: Ron, this is ALL just made up in your head. This is your opinion and your words. You are entitled to them but they are not valid facts about Seth. They are not anything objective about Seth or anything close to that. These are your opinions; and MY opinion is that you are totally making this up. I don’t mean that you are lying about what you believe…but the source of what you say is you. The source of what I say is me. But I also do quote Seth, Jane and Rob on this particular topic of communicating via others.
What Seth University? Because say so, it exists? The same with your Dream Campus and Seth’s family of consciousness. I could equally say that I visit Seth’s Dream Golf Course with Seth’s family of consciousness acting as caddies and speaking wisdom between my golf strokes, THAT is just as valid as what you say. You just make it up. You try to objectify your own subjective beliefs.
Ron Continues: All you do, Barrie, is unfortunately project negativity upon anyone who doesn’t bow at the alter of Barrie, and, frankly, spiritual ignorance is at the basis of your negative beliefs.
Barrie Responds: Ron, this is silly. You so much don’t know me at all. I don’t want anyone to bow at an altar of Barrie. That altar does not exist. And IF it did, I would destroy it myself. I think you are projecting onto me, Ron. I think you want to have an altar of Ron…and can’t stand having it challenged in any serious way. My message to anyone is to trust YOURSELF over Seth, me or anyone else. And that has been my clearly stated message for all my Seth-related communications that began decades ago.
Also, does it strike you as ironic at all, Ron, how you address my words as negative; yet your words to me reek with negativity?
These are my “negative” comments about you: You use the name “Seth” as a symbol for your own inner communications. You seem to believe that your opinions are facts and that others either follow or agree with…or else they are spiritually ignorant. I believe these things to be true.
Ron Continues: I once had a private talk with Rob, back in 1999 about people;s negative projections and how it comes back to the person doing the projecting.
Barrie Comments: This is funny, Ron. You are the one with negative projections onto me. Let me know if and when it comes back to you.
Ron Continues: Franky, I do not need a permission slip to SPEAK on Seth’s behalf, you see.
Barrie Responds: Frankly, I agree. You do not need permission to claim to speak on Seth’s behalf. I just think it is important that people know what Seth, Jane and Rob actually SAID on this topic…and not just rely on your opinions-as-facts comments.
Ron Continues: I reach WE ARE SETH by going through my vast, inner being, my wellspring of knowledge and wisdom that exists within me, and every Seth session and every ESP class session is archived in the psychic library of ALL THAT IS, and anyone can visit any session they wish, as i have on occasion.
Barrie Comments: You are building quite the altar for yourself, aren’t you? In my opinion,
Ron, you use Seth’s name as a symbol for your own inner communications…just like Seth said people will do. Does your vast, inner being and your wellspring of knowledge and wisdom—tell you about me? Has it told you of my spiritual ignorance? Does it tell you about what I missed and how much I ignored things in the Seth material? That does sound a tad arrogant and altar-speaking, yes? By the way, perhaps you can consult your inner Seth Brother and find out how to spell “altar.”
It so happens, that I agree that we ALL have our vast inner beings, our wellspring of knowledge and wisdom. It exists in each and every one of us. It is not Seth, tho. It is US. It is our own Seth-equivalent, if you will. Jane had Seth and we each have our own entities within us, connected to us, so to speak.
It also so happens, that whatever we believe this inner wisdom to be or what these inner beings are saying to us—may not actually be correct or valid. It may be greatly distorted. It may be our own hopes and dreams. Our own subjective thoughts. Or it may be some inner being—who we may be correctly or incorrectly interpreting, understanding or misunderstanding. Just because you believe something is from Seth or in this inner psychic library—doesn’t make it so. I do hope your altar is not so high that you do not realize this.
Put another way, just because you loudly claim and loudly insult those who disagree with you—doesn’t make anything you say any more true.
AND, Ron, it so happens, that EVERYTHING I say is ALSO based on my inner wisdom and inner beings, and so forth. And I recognize that I may make mistakes and get things wrong. Don’t you see that about yourself? And I believe what I just said is true for everyone—and that includes all of us not looking up to you on your altar.
Ron Continues: So I use my inner pathways to CONTINUE Seth’s continuing education because Seth had forty years of dictating through Jane, but, due to circumstances that occurred after Jane was born, Seth only got nearly 21 years, so there’s 19 MORE years of Seth’s work, PLUS a number of books that Seth had already to dictate that he could not get through Jane, like the Christ Book, which I have, incidentally glimpsed in the dream state, and my ten un-published Seth sessions in Rob’s transcript volume #18, contains 3 never before seen Christ sessions with very enlightening information that did not get published in book form by Rick Stack.
Barrie Comments: Whew, Ron, that is quite the mouthful. I guess you are the one that alters and controls the future…contradicting what Seth, Jane and Rob actually said on the topic. Again, you are using Seth as a SYMBOL for your own inner communications. Sometimes, I can’t believe you are serious. So, Seth had no time to tell us all—that lo and behold, he had changed his mind. He will now communicate with anyone because of the linear years involved as you state them. Don’t you see how you are just making all these ideas up? Conjecturing things and declaring them facts?
Were you continuing Seth’s education when you claimed to be re-writing the Seth material as one would re-write an old encyclopedia? Just wondering.
In any case, Seth said he would only communicate via Jane in order to maintain the integrity and authenticity of the Seth material and to avoid great distortion. He was speaking of people doing just what you are doing…as people did this during Jane’s life as well. They each had their convoluted theories as to why THEY are correct. Seth shot each one down, so to speak.
Ron Continues: There’s considerable Seth out there waiting to be explored and expanded upon besides the Seth that did get through Jane…
Barrie Continues: Ron, you seem to worship Seth. I think your Seth artifacts got to you like in an Edgar Allen Poe short story. YOU are out there, Ron. YOU are in there, Ron. YOU are the one with the inner wisdom inside. YOUR inner wisdom. YOUR voice, YOUR own entity…and so forth. Take hold of YOUR own power, Ron. Be YOU…not someone else.
Ron Continues: …you understand, Barrie, as we are all students of the ENDLESS material on our own unique paths of exploration, and my path is different from yours, but just a valid, you see.
Barrie Responds: IF our paths are both unique and simply different, then why did you call me spiritually ignorant? Why did you say how much I missed and was ignorant what was in the Seth material? That doesn’t sound like we have separate but equal endless paths of exploration. It sounds just like you have the right path; the correct path—and I don’t. I sound like you do PROJECT onto me: That is is Ron who right and on the altar and anyone who disagrees with him is wrong and ignorant with their egos in the way. Ron, you do sound very hypocritical. Is that negative? Sorry…but I believe it to be true.
Ron Continues: I still like you Barrie, and I wish you well, as you, too, are going to transcend at some point as all the old guard Sethians are checking out, including me of course. At that point, we’ll meet in Seth Medieval “man cave” for a great chat!..Cheers, ron
Barrie Responds: Spare me, Ron. I am sorry, but I recognize your bullshit. Why do I say that? Because you have so cruelly lied about me online behind my back after you blocked me and let no one know you did so. You challenged me to respond to your posts, knowing alone that I couldn’t even see them…while telling others how I didn’t respond because I was so afraid to respond because you would “tear me another asshole.” And then, when I found out and welcomed any debate, you just shut up.
You lied about me and my relations with others in Seth class. You lied about me and my wife—that she left me and had to move to Florida to get away from me—and the list does go on, Ron.
I am so honored, Ron, that you still like me—even tho I am spiritually ignorant and missed so much in and am so ignorant of what is in the Seth material because of my ego.
So, Ron, at least with me, stop pretending. You have exposed your cruelty that lurks behind your little jokes, smiles and friendly words. I know you to be a liar and a liar with the intent to demean and hurt because you have so much lied about me. IF that is how you treat those you allegedly like—I feel sorry for those you allegedly do not like.
I posted this post yesterday. It was delayed because of a website error.
Response One to Ron:
Ron Writes: Barrie, Guess what? I have considerable Seth material dictated by Jane that you are not aware of…… I’ll be going through for months ahead and discovering TONS of Sethian easter eggs!
Barrie Responds: I am aware of all this. People on your site copy and paste things on their own that they believe would be of interest tome. What’s the point? It’s nice you have those things…but so what? Anything you believe that I am not aware of you know is because you block me from seeing what you post and obviously responding to it.
Ron Continues: Also, something AMAZING that I came across that only Laurel knows, and now me, and i have the original material here, and that is, on January 20th, 1986, Laurel and Rob documented a short session using THE Ouija board, whereby Seth came through the board and gave very revealing information, including about Jane and Malba. I have blockbuster Seth information that I must sit on for the time being.
Barrie Responds: Again, Ron…that’s nice…but so what? If you’re gonna post it…that’s nice, too, but since you block me I wouldn’t be able to see it anyway. Why are you even telling me now? I don’t mind you telling me, but I am curious as to why.
Ron Continues: You might also like to know that when I displayed my extensive Seth Museum Collection at the Seth House for Rob’s 100 birthday celebration event in summer of 1999, I brought along THE Ouija board–that I had obtained from Laurel in 2015, and me and Kate and Oshara played it in Jane and Rob’s apartment #5, and Seth came through and identified himself and we had a short session, that we documented in text and photos, and Seth told us that he and Jane and Rob were well aware of what we were doing with the Seth House and were very pleases with our plans to preserve it for future generations of Seth-minded people.
Barrie Responds: Ron, I believe that you just make things up in your head and “validate” it by your own say so. I believe you use Seth’s name as symbol for your own inner communication. I don’t believe that anything you say you pick up from Seth on a Ouija or in a dream is anything but you using your own symbols to communicate with yourself about yourself. You want people to believe, including me, that whatever you imagine or say or pretend is true—just because you say so. I think you should recognize your own voice and your own power and stop riding Jane’s coattails and hard work.
RESPONSE TWO TO RON:
Ron Continues: So, Seth–and his WE ARE SETH family of teachers is, as we know, alive and well, and he will communicate when invited through the Ouija board, and Rob and Jane can also be contacted as well, for research purposes, and I have THE Ouija board right here under wraps awaiting future use.
Barrie Responds: Ron, I believe you actually have no idea what you are talking about with your “WE ARE SETH family of teachers.” You just seem to believe that you can just say whatever you want and others are supposed to follow along. Nothing you say is true just because you say it is true.
Ron, I see you as part of the “fake Seth, new Seth” or “alternate Seth” people. You and they claim to communicate NOT for Jane’s Seth, but for a Seth who is from a Seth family. You and they misunderstand and/or misinterpret SETH2 as simply a relative of Seth—like a sibling or cousin. Likewise, you misunderstand the phrase "WE ARE SETH.” Briefly, Seth2 is to Seth as Seth is to us. Jane has also referred to Seth2 as Seth’s ENTITY.
You push the idea that people can still communicate with or for this “new” version or relative of Seth if they really want to—just for the asking—with the caveat that it is not Jane’s Seth—but an evolved Seth since Jane died—or a “relative” of Seth that they tie into Seth2 as well. But these people TOTALLY get Seth2 ALL wrong.
They think of Jane’s Seth as SETH1, then claim that SETH2 is the next peer Seth teacher around for the asking…and this implies that there are many other Seths–a Seth3, 4 and so on–and ALL available to meet with ANYONE upon request–and all are called Seth, of course.
Upon simply reading this, it may sound reasonable and logical but it is FAR from both. In fact, it actually makes NO sense. As an analogy, it’s like saying that IF there is a magnitude ONE earthquake THEN the next earthquake to follow is a magnitude two, and then the next are magnitudes, 3, 4, 5, 6 etc etc…AS IF the Richter Scale was just a CHRONOLOGICAL ORDERING of earthquakes.
THAT SAME magnitude of ERROR is made with Seth and Seth2. Seth2 is NOT just another Seth teacher or the next Seth teacher…in the same way that a Magnitude 2 earthquake is NOT just the NEXT earthquake to occur.
Seth2 did NOT simply interact with Jane like Seth did. Actually, Seth2 is TOTALLY incomprehensible to us—as he, she or IT itself has said:
Seth2 (Session 588): “ Our existence is such that COMMUNICATION MUST be made BY OTHERS TO YOU. VERBAL SYMBOLS HAVE NO MEANING for us. OUR EXPERIENCE IS NOT TRANSLATABLE…WE PERCEIVE YOUR THOUGHTS AS LIGHTS”
Seth 2 (ESP Class, 4-20-71): “We move through systems such as yours FASTER THAN THE SPEED OF LIGHT, and so what I am saying IS ALREADY A TRANSLATION and, in your terms, a message left in the past of your time…”
Seth 2 (ESP Class, 10-14-69): “WE are involved in FORMING CREATIONS, REALITIES, CONSCIOUSNESS – worlds beyond your comprehension. Within these, Seth as you know him is a SHADOW WITHIN MY AWARENESS…WE do not deal with sensory data, as you know it. WE FORM THE REALITIES; WE GIVE BIRTH TO UNIVERSES…” end qt
Barrie Comments: So, you can see that NO ONE can SIMPLY claim that they are NOW communicating with Seth2 or Seth’s ENTITY.
Some claim that Seth has morphed or evolved into something or someone else AFTER Jane’s death in 1984, and so that CANCELS OUT all that Seth and Jane said previously. THEY say that Seth has changed SO MUCH in the last 36 linear years SINCE Jane’s death—that he is no longer the Seth that Jane knew…and apparently NO longer cares about the integrity and authenticity of the material.
Tell me, DID Seth change or evolve in 1984, RIGHT after Jane died? Or was it 1985–a year AFTER Jane’s passing? Or was it at some point in the 36 linear years SINCE she died? Does anyone REALLY BELIEVE that Seth, who has been around for AGES, has NOW evolved or expanded within 36 earth years? And somehow, EACH of these “fake-or-new Seth” folks are privy to this information—with NO evidence given, of course, except their own say so?
And SOME of these folks believe that SETH2 is ONE of these NEWLY-evolved Seths. The one that comes AFTER Seth1.
UNFORTUNATELY, these folks have NO idea who or what Seth2 is. For example, Seth 2 has NEVER been physical and can BARELY stay close to the physical realm, so to speak.
Seth 2 (ESP Class, 5-28-68): “I come to you from a dimension which you neither know nor understand, and yet that dimension is a portion of all reality. I CANNOT SEE YOUR OWN CAMOUFLAGED STRUCTURES CLEARLY, I CANNOT PERCEIVE TIME, AS IT APPEARS TO YOU. I CAN ONLY TO SOME EXTENT COMMUNICATE AT THIS CHANNEL… I can IMPART information that is not distorted in three-dimensional terms simply because I am so apart from three-dimensional reality. On many occasions I TRANSMIT INFORMATION TO YOUR SETH and he then gives it to you. end qt
Barrie Comments: So, Seth is not simply A “Seth” but he also acts a medium, so to speak, giving SETH2 information to Jane as well as his OWN information.
Seth (ESP Class, 10-21-69): “He (Seth2) knows a portion of him is filtering down into this room… and in his OWN way he is aware of you and of the room. Now, when the sun shines and the rays fall from the sun down through your solar system, the sun is not consciously aware of its rays nor of the rooms that these rays may illuminate. This “other personality” is aware that a part of himself is filtering down, and in his OWN way he is aware of YOU and of the room…BUT HE IS NOT AWARE OF YOU AS YOU KNOW YOURSELVES, AND HE IS SCARCELY AWARE OF ME AS I KNOW MYSELF. HE IS AWARE OF ME, BUT IN ANOTHER CONTEXT, AND IN ANOTHER DIMENSION OF EXISTENCE.” end qt
Barrie Comments: So, obviously Seth2 is NOT just Seth’s cousin or sibling. But rather, Seth2 is SO advanced that he is “scarcely aware” of Seth; and Jane couldn’t communicate with him on her own. First, she COULDN’T go far enough to “meet” him—she NEEDED Seth as a translator or intermediary in order to meet him halfway, so to speak. THEN, two, even if she COULD get close to Seth2, she WOULDN’T be able to understand him anyway.
Seth2 (ESP Class, 5-28-68): “I have not traveled where you are, and yet a portion of me that you know as Seth has so traveled. I AM MORE DIVORCED FROM YOU THAN HE IS. There is more effort involved in theses communications, for RUBURT MUST COME FARTHER, SINCE I CANNOT COME CLOSER.”
Barrie Comments: So, Seth had to TRANSLATE SETH2 for Jane for her to EVEN understand Seth 2 because Seth2 is so REMOVED from human existence. JANE couldn’t even REACH Seth2. And allegedly NOW EVERYONE can for the asking, as well as Seth3 & 4?
RESPONSE THREE TO RON
Barrie Comments: So, the #2 of Seth2 is NOT just a number like that of EQUAL Seths on a baseball team. Seth1 is the pitcher, Seth 2 is the catcher, and so forth, with Seth9 in right field.
So, CLEARLY Seth 2 was NOT just another Seth in the Seth family of EQUAL Seths that we ALL can just communicate with or for or learn from in the dream, trance or some OTHER alternate state.
Seth2 is ANCIENT beyond infinity—Seth 2 or him or “WE” – have TAUGHT THE HUMAN RACE how to CREATE PHYSICAL REALITY in the FIRST place; how to CREATE physical objects, and so forth. Seth2 is NOT simply another Seth teacher or peer:
Seth2 (ESP Class; 7-15-69): WE want you to realize that there is consciousness without form , that there is consciousness with will and vitality that comes to you from BEYOND EVEN THOSE PLACES THAT YOUR SETH KNOWS. WE want you to realize that though it is hard for us to communicate, WE SPOKE WITH YOUR RACE BEFORE your race learned language. WE gave you mental images and upon these images you LEARNED TO FORM the world that you know.
“WE gave you the PATTERN BY WHICH YOUR PHYSICAL SELVES ARE FORMED. WE gave you the pattern by which YOU LEARNED TO FORM YOUR PHYSICAL REALITY. WE gave you the patterns intricate, involved and blessed from which YOU FORM THE REALITY OF EACH PHYSICAL THING YOU KNOW. We gave you the PATTERN upon which you FORMED your ENTIRE PHYSICAL UNIVERSE and the COMPREHENSION THAT EXISTS WITHIN EACH CELL , the knowledge that EACH CELL has, the desire for organization was given by us. The ENTIRE WEBWORK WAS INITIATED by us. WE TAUGHT YOU TO FORM THE REALITY THAT YOU KNOW.” end qt
Barrie Comments: So, Seth 2 taught or GAVE us the “patterns of consciousness” so that we could FORM the “reality we know” and the “entire physical universe” in the FIRST place. But he is NOT a part of our reality at all. From the Seth 2 POV, he understands that ALL of our physical universe is like a fantasy that we see as “one indivisible reality.” He is NOT a being, creature or entity that visits us in our dreams:
About the term “WE.” It is ABSOLUTELY NOTHING like the super simplified version of “WE” that we as humans routinely use. We CAN’T grasp Seth 2 at all and we CERTAINLY can’t grasp the “WE” that he refers to—which is really a consciousness energy, or energy-gestalt personality, or a “multi-dimensional personality structure” BEYOND our COMPREHENSION. They have NO bodies, never did; no gender, NOTHING HUMAN at all.
Seth II (ESP Class, 1-13-70): “ YOU DO NOT UNDERSTAND MULTI-DIMENSIONAL PERSONALITY STRUCTURES.
SethII (ESP Class; 7-15-69): There is consciousness with will and vitality that comes to you from BEYOND EVEN THOSE PLACES THAT YOUR SETH KNOWS.
Barrie Comments: And now…voila…Jane DIED and Seth is NOW Seth2? The next Seth on the team who has WAITED to step forward? Or Seth is NOW some new, alternate Seth; and it took 1-36 linear earth years for an ancient personality like Seth to SUDDENLY “evolve?” And on TOP of that, he no longer cares about the integrity and authenticity of his material?
Seth2 (ESP Class,10-14-69): “We sent him (Seth) to you in YOUR terms in some INDESCRIBABLY DISTANT PAST. He entered your universe in a reality I find difficult to remember. He gave guidance to your kind FOR EONS OF YOUR TIME. I do not sufficiently understand the experience in which you are presently involved, in your terms.”
RESPONSE FOUR TO RON:
Barrie Comments: As I said, some have referred to all of these “Seths” as a FAMILY of Seths—like one of our earth families—whose members have apparently just WAITED for Jane to die before ALL of them could finally come forward to communicate with ANYONE who asks. WHY would Jane have to die first? This “family” must have ALWAYS been around, right? OR did it ONLY start in 1963 when Jane first started with Seth or only after JANE’S death in 1984?
In MY opinion, overlooking the potential financial windfall of USING Seth’s name, there is ALSO a narcissistic or myopic perspective existing with these “alternate” Seth folks or their followers that dictates to them that Seth operates on THEIR linear needs and linear time.
BUT Seth2 IS an energy, or multi-dimensional personality structure, SO TOTALLY beyond our limited, human understanding. Those folks DON’T realize this–proudly claim that “THEIR” Seth is NOT Jane’s Seth but Seth2. They so desperately hold on to A Seth, or ANY Seth, because EACH believe they SO NEED a Seth; or for themselves or financial reward…or BOTH.
When people claim with ALL sincerity or not—that ANYONE in a dream or alternate state can contact an expanded or family-member Seth just for the asking—they do not seem to realize that these are their SUBJECTIVE dream BELIEFS. Seth has become their SYMBOL-seen-as-fact because they won’t, don’t or CAN’T see “THEIR Seth” as a symbol.
Seth (ESP Class, 3-12-74): Class Member: “Seth, would you help me in my DREAMS if I tried to contact you?”
Seth Responds: “You help yourself in your OWN DREAMS. You do not need me. You may use the SYMBOL of me, but when you do, it is a SYMBOL of your own inner knowledge, for I am the SYMBOL of the knowledge that dwells within each of your psyches. I am MYSELF, but beyond that I am the SYMBOL OF THE KNOWLEDGE THAT DWELLS WITHIN EACH OF YOUR PSYCHES.”
RESPONSE FIVE TO RON:
Barrie Comments: As I said, some use the phrase “WE ARE SETH” to explain that there actually IS some sort of Seth family—a Seth2,3,4 etc, --that you can ALWAYS contact in your dreams or elsewhere just for the asking.
As Seth2 said, this “WE” is a “consciousness from beyond even those places that your Seth knows. Seth2 added added that “you do not understand multi-dimensional personality structures.”
Yet, these folks have concocted this whole “Seth family” theory or “alternate-Seth” theory in order to HAVE a Seth to hold on to. BUT all you need is yourself, as Seth said: “You do not need me . You may use the SYMBOL of me,”
So, these folks NEED to create convoluted theories in order to grab an IMAGINARY Seth to hold ONTO and bring back from their alternate or dream states in order to SHARE with everyone when they are awake. They don’t realize that they FORSAKE their own self, and transfer THEIR inner OWN knowledge over to a SYMBOLIC Seth.
They have wittingly or unwittingly fabricated a COMIC BOOK fictionalized Seth.
Seth (Deleted Session 7-2-77): “People become FRIGHTENED sometimes…They want to think that I spring AUTOMATICALLY into your lives, as SUPERMAN. They did not question Superman. Only a simple change of clothing was required for our hero, Mr. Kent. They do NOT want Ruburt’s inquiring mind to intrude.
"What comic book reader wants to bother with a CLARK KENT … Or worse–wants Clark Kent to shout out from the phone booth, or wherever: “You can do (your version) of this too because we ALL have a reality in which we are Clark Kent AND Superman at one and the same time”? Such people simply want Superman to PERFORM HIS MIRACLES.
"They want to keep Clark Kent and Superman entirely SEPARATE on a mental, psychical, and physical basis, and ONLY in the terms of our analogy…I become a SUPERSOUL rather than SUPERMAN. They do not want MY AUTHORITY questioned…They think that if THEY had their OWN SUPERSOUL they would have FAR better sense than Ruburt, and they would use me as if I were a MAGIC GENIE. They are afraid Ruburt might…QUESTION ME OUT OF EXISTENCE, for they do NOT understand that Ruburt’s questions, and YOURS (Rob’s), your sense of INTEGRITY, are partially responsible for a “superman” rather than a SUPERMOUSE.”
Barrie Comments: In other words, people want their OWN Superman (Supersoul or Seth) WITHOUT bothering with Clark Kent (Jane). As they NEVER questioned Superman, they now will NEVER question their own “Seth,” but rather just receive his “miracles” FREE from Jane. THEY would use Seth without her “questioning Seth out of existence.” They DON’T understand that it IS Rob’s and Jane’s questioning and integrity that made Seth a “superman” or “supersoul” giving great material. WITHOUT that, Seth would have been a “supermouse” with weak, watered down, poorly written material—just like the unquestioned new, alternative and fake “Seths” now provide AFTER Jane’s death…
AND they have also myopically imagined. a mundane family of “We Are Seth” –made up of Seth relatives–while the actual “WE ARE SETH” is BEYOND human understanding.
Seth2 (ESP Class, 6-14-73): “WE ARE SETH and we speak to those portions of your being who have not known physical lives, or rather, WE SPEAK FOR THOSE PORTIONS WHO HAVE NOT KNOWN PHYSICAL LIVES. For each of you have counterparts who are aliens to physical reality…Translations are difficult. YOUR EMOTIONS GROW LIKE FLOWERS FROM YOUR BEING…ALIEN TO US. We marvel and water your flesh.”
Seth2 (Session 588): “WE are the voices who speak without tongues of our own. WE are SOURCES of that energy from which you come…WE SEEDED YOUR UNIVERSE…(WE) have (never) known physical existence. Our joy created the exaltation from which your world comes…VERBAL SYMBOLS have NO meaning for us. OUR EXPERIENCE IS NOT TRANSLATABLE…WE PERCEIVE YOUR THOUGHTS AS LIGHTS…It is nearly impossible for US to explain our reality. Know only that WE exist. WE send immeasurable vitality to you…YOU ARE NEVER ALONE.”
Barrie Comments: So, I’m sorry but NOTHING these folks say about SETH2 or WE ARE SETH makes any sense outside of being their OWN SYMBOLS used to OBJECTIFY Seth2 as just another Seth—so that Seth IS STILL AROUND to learn from or cash in on and we are NOT alone OR on our own.
I’ll “let” Seth have the final word in closing:
Seth (Deleted Session, 7-2-77): “(These people) distrust themselves…they use MY position as a substitute for the AUTHORITY they are trying to give up. They think, “IF I HAD A SETH, I too would progress”, and so forth…”
Yes, I made that clear. However, you understand, that from Jane and Rob’s PROBABLE reality perspective in Miami, they look upon their reality in Elmira as a probable reality. ALL realities are probable, but you are focused in the “official” reality to relate to with your physical senses, and probable realities are perceived through the use of the inner senses, you see. Had a fantastic dream class session in Seth University, Dream Campus last night. – ron
Barrie, for your edification, that is, for your information, you completely missed Seth’s point. Back then, Seth made those statements about specifically working with Jane ONLY WHILE SHE WAS ALIVE. Why, because of all the then copycat Seth bandwagon Seth fakers, who were diluting, confusing, the genuine Jane - Seth work, so Seth made it very clear that he was working WITH ONE EARTH PSYCHIC MEDIUM at a time as to maintain the integrity of the material. Sorry you missed this Barrie. And, besides, there is no need to worry about the integrity of the Seth material from 1963 to 1984, because Seth’s words have already been set in COPYRIGHTED book print, the integrity is in the copyright, which Laurel Davies-Butts still holds, and, Laurel licenses out, for money, the sub-rights to certain portions of the material, like to Rick Stack and other publishers of the Seth material. For your information Barrie, Laurel, my very good friend, has given me a signed contract for me to create, publish and distribute, sell, a SETH DECK OF CARDS. I paid Laurel a few thousand dollars for the rights to do a card deck of Seth sayings, and I have Laurel’s permission to use whatever Seth quotes for my card deck. As you may recall, Robert Butts gave Joyce Jones, an artist and Seth aficionado, in the late, 1990s permission to do a Seth deck, which she did, copyright 2001, Joy distributing, and they’re all long gone, sold mainly at Seth conferences–workshops back then, and Laurel thought my idea for a new Seth deck was a great idea, and today there is wide interest for such a deck with millions new Seth readers all over the globe. I haven’t acted upon my contract as yet, I’m still thinking about how to proceed for maximum appeal and sales. But when I do create the new Seth deck, I’ll be sure to send you a signed, complementary edition copy. So getting back to Seth’s involvement with Jane, it spanned her lifetime only as members of the Seth family of consciousness, WE ARE SETH, have always been teachers and always will be. Give me your new address in sunny, warm, FLA so i can put you on the list for a Seth deck. Oh, wait a minute, no need, I just Googled your address! – ron
Ron Writes: Yes, I made that clear. However, you understand, that from Jane and Rob’s PROBABLE reality perspective in Miami, they look upon their reality in Elmira as a probable reality. ALL realities are probable, but you are focused in the “official” reality to relate to with your physical senses, and probable realities are perceived through the use of the inner senses, you see. Had a fantastic dream class session in Seth University, Dream Campus last night.
Barrie Responds: Do you realize how ridiculous this sounds? Ron, you are MAKING THIS UP in your head. I don’t mean that you are purposely constructing a false tale. I mean that this is just your imagination, your feeling or opinion…it is not fact.
It is as true and valid as me talking about how there is a Dream Seth Golf Course upon which anyone can play golf with members of the Seth family acting as caddies and dispensing with inner wisdom as they walk around the course. My proof? I say so. I say it is true. My evidence? I say so. And isn’t it obvious that I am correct?
And Yes, Ron, ALL realities are probable—and you, Ron, are not privy in any objective, factually, provable way to ANYTHING about anyone else’s infinite probable realities…let alone Jane’s and Rob’s, mine, Biden’s, Joan Baez’s and so forth.
We EACH have INFINITE numbers of probable realities ever growing and expanding…along with infinite dream realities expanding and the dream realities in each probable reality etc etc.
YOU, Ron, ME, everyone—has NO CONSCIOUS IDEA what is going on in our own infinite numbers of probable realities. We may guess at some of them. 10, 20, 100? I don’t know…but their numbers are infinite and ever growing…let alone the infinite probable realities of other people.
I’m not sure if you are delusional, lying, narcissistically arrogant, or what…but just because you DECLARE something doesn’t make it true or valid—for yourself even—for you may just be mistaking SYMBOLS as facts—and certainly not for anyone else.
So, when you write that you are involved in some Miami Probable Seth classes, etc…I call BS, to use a Florida expression. You can GUESS all you want about what you are really involved in—but nothing you say is true or valid simply because you say it.
And to me, it seems like a very desperate attempt to keep a Seth in your life somehow…ANY Seth…ANY type of a Seth.
I recommend, even tho you do not ask, that you recognize your own power; your OWN voice. You are in RON’S University Dream Campus. Let you be you. YOU are the answer you seek.
Ron Writes: Barrie, for your edification, that is, for your information, you completely missed Seth’s point. Back then, Seth made those statements about specifically working with Jane ONLY WHILE SHE WAS ALIVE. Why, because of all the then copycat Seth bandwagon Seth fakers, who were diluting, confusing, the genuine Jane - Seth work, so Seth made it very clear that he was working WITH ONE EARTH PSYCHIC MEDIUM at a time as to maintain the integrity of the material.
Barrie Responds: Ron, this is your FANTASY. WHERE did Seth make it very clear? You are just making this up. He said he could not even communicate with Jane if it wasn’t for Rob. He needed the two of them. Without that, the work would be so distorted it wouldn’t be worth it.
If “fake Sethers” could dilute and confuse his material WHILE Jane was ALIVE—imagine what they or you can do NOW—that she is dead. Seth was concerned with maintaining the integrity and authenticity of the material. Does that END after Jane died? No. Do you really CLAIM that Seth said that he would communicate ONLY thru Jane—but AFTER she dies he will communicate with anyone and everyone who asks? Do your REALLY BELIEVE that THIS is maintaining the integrity and authenticity of the material? No way, Ron.
And IF Seth had any INKLING to do anything close to what you say, he couldn’t just said it in his last book thru Jane or at any time thru-out his work. He could have said something like, “Dear readers, do not worry about losing me. I will ALWAYS be there for you after Jane dies, I will be there for everyone just for the asking. I no longer care about the integrity of the material because Jane will be dead.”
He never said or hinted at that Ron. Seth NEVER made it clear that he would only work WITH ONE EARTH PSYCHIC MEDIUM at a time. This is YOUR delusion. This is YOUR unique way to prove and show that YOU are correct. Don’t you realize that every single person who contacted Jane about “their” Seth—be it channelling, in the dream state, automatic writing or ANYTHING—EACH ONE OF THEM had their own intricate, unique and intimate theories, reasons and/or explanations about WHY THEY ARE CORRECT. Each powerfully believed their own unique theories—only to be shot down Seth, so to speak.
The idea that Seth would ruin the integrity of his work—to communicate via others with watered down and weak material loaded with distortions—as Crazy Eddie said—is INSANE.
By the way, Ron, WHERE does he make this perfectly clear about one medium at a time? And HOW would that maintain the authenticity of integrity of is material?
Ron Continues: Sorry you missed this Barrie. And, besides, there is no need to worry about the integrity of the Seth material from 1963 to 1984, because Seth’s words have already been set in COPYRIGHTED book print, the integrity is in the copyright, which Laurel Davies-Butts still holds, and, Laurel licenses out, for money, the sub-rights to certain portions of the material, like to Rick Stack and other publishers of the Seth material.
Barrie Responds: Don’t you think Seth and Jane knew that? Wasn’t the work copyrighted then? Why would the integrity be MORE threatened when Jane and Seth were alive and could speak up? But after Jane has died—it would be LESS threatened and all is well and the integrity is safe. NOTHING has changed copyright-wise since Jane first began copyrighting her work.
The authenticity and integrity of the work get threatened and ruined…when all the fake Seth people. including you, start putting out their OWN Seth quotes and Seth books or quotes USING Seth’s name. In time, Jane’s Seth words and work and all of these other Seth’s words and work would all BLEND together as the “Seth Material.” It would be a watered down, weak mishhash of conflicting statements and statements Seth would never make. THAT is show the integrity and authenticity of the Seth material gets ruined.
By the way, don’t you find it strange that ALL of these fake-Seth folks came up with the name Seth after Jane made it popular?
Ron Continues: For your information Barrie, Laurel, my very good friend, has given me a signed contract for me to create, publish and distribute, sell, a SETH DECK OF CARDS. I paid Laurel a few thousand dollars for the rights to do a card deck of Seth sayings, and I have Laurel’s permission to use whatever Seth quotes for my card deck.
Barrie Responds: Ron, so what? You can publish all the Seth decks of cards you want. You can publish Seth posters, Seth anything…BUT you would be clearly publishing Seth’s work with JANE. You would be MAINAINING the integrity and authenticity of the Seth material. You can tattoo Seth quotes on your teeth, tongue and lips—and the integrity of the Seth material would remain intact.
Ron Continues: As you may recall, Robert Butts gave Joyce Jones, an artist and Seth aficionado, in the late, 1990s permission to do a Seth deck, which she did, copyright 2001, Joy distributing, and they’re all long gone, sold mainly at Seth conferences–workshops back then, and Laurel thought my idea for a new Seth deck was a great idea, and today there is wide interest for such a deck with millions new Seth readers all over the globe.
Barrie Responds: So what? Very nice. I hope people enjoy their decks of cards with Seth’s quotes on them. But this has ABSOLUTELY NOTHING to do with fake Sethers coming up with THEIR new Seth books and Seth quotes. They would then be stealing Seth’s name and identity and riding on the coattails of Jane’s hard work…as you do with your Seth Dream University, etc.
Ron Continues: I haven’t acted upon my contract as yet, I’m still thinking about how to proceed for maximum appeal and sales. But when I do create the new Seth deck, I’ll be sure to send you a signed, complementary edition copy.
Barrie Responds: Yeah, sure Ron. Great. None of this involved fake Sethers.
Ron Continues: So getting back to Seth’s involvement with Jane, it spanned her lifetime only as members of the Seth family of consciousness, WE ARE SETH, have always been teachers and always will be.
Barrie Responds: Ron, you really have no idea what you make up and pretend in your head. You use the phrase “WE ARE SETH” to explain that there actually IS some sort of Seth family—a Seth2,3,4 etc, --that you can ALWAYS contact in your dreams or elsewhere just for the asking.
As Seth2 said, this “WE” is a “consciousness from beyond even those places that your Seth knows. Seth2 added that “you do not understand multi-dimensional personality structures.” He wasn’t talking to YOU, Ron…but it certainly is true for you as for all of us.
Yet, you and these fake or new Seth folks have concocted this whole “Seth family” theory or “alternate-Seth” theory in order to HAVE a Seth to hold on to. BUT all you need is yourself, as Seth said: “You do not need me . You may use the SYMBOL of me,”
You, Ron, seem to desperately NEED to create convoluted theories in order to grab an IMAGINARY Seth to hold ONTO and bring back from your alternate or dream state in order to SHARE with everyone when you are awake. You don’t realize that you FORSAKE your own self, and transfer YOUR inner OWN knowledge over to a SYMBOLIC Seth.
You have wittingly or unwittingly fabricated a COMIC BOOK fictionalized Seth.
Seth (Deleted Session 7-2-77): “People become FRIGHTENED sometimes…They want to think that I spring AUTOMATICALLY into your lives, as SUPERMAN. They did not question Superman. Only a simple change of clothing was required for our hero, Mr. Kent. They do NOT want Ruburt’s inquiring mind to intrude.
"What comic book reader wants to bother with a CLARK KENT … Or worse–wants Clark Kent to shout out from the phone booth, or wherever: “You can do (your version) of this too because we ALL have a reality in which we are Clark Kent AND Superman at one and the same time”? Such people simply want Superman to PERFORM HIS MIRACLES.
"They want to keep Clark Kent and Superman entirely SEPARATE on a mental, psychical, and physical basis, and ONLY in the terms of our analogy…I become a SUPERSOUL rather than SUPERMAN. They do not want MY AUTHORITY questioned…They think that if THEY had their OWN SUPERSOUL they would have FAR better sense than Ruburt, and they would use me as if I were a MAGIC GENIE. They are afraid Ruburt might…QUESTION ME OUT OF EXISTENCE, for they do NOT understand that Ruburt’s questions, and YOURS (Rob’s), your sense of INTEGRITY, are partially responsible for a “superman” rather than a SUPERMOUSE.” end qt
Barrie Comments: In other words, people like you want their OWN Superman (Supersoul or Seth) WITHOUT bothering with Clark Kent (Jane). As they NEVER questioned Superman, they now will NEVER question their own “Seth,” but rather just receive his “miracles” FREE from Jane. THEY would use Seth without her “questioning Seth out of existence.” They DON’T understand that it IS Rob’s and Jane’s questioning and integrity that made Seth a “superman” or “supersoul” giving great material. WITHOUT that, Seth would have been a “supermouse” with weak, watered down, poorly written material—just like the unquestioned new, alternative and fake “Seths” now provide AFTER Jane’s death…
AND they have also myopically imagined. a mundane family of “We Are Seth” –made up of Seth relatives–while the actual “WE ARE SETH” is BEYOND human understanding.
Seth2 (ESP Class, 6-14-73): “WE ARE SETH and we speak to those portions of your being who have not known physical lives, or rather, WE SPEAK FOR THOSE PORTIONS WHO HAVE NOT KNOWN PHYSICAL LIVES. For each of you have counterparts who are aliens to physical reality…Translations are difficult. YOUR EMOTIONS GROW LIKE FLOWERS FROM YOUR BEING…ALIEN TO US. We marvel and water your flesh.”
Seth2 (Session 588): “WE are the voices who speak without tongues of our own. WE are SOURCES of that energy from which you come…WE SEEDED YOUR UNIVERSE…(WE) have (never) known physical existence. Our joy created the exaltation from which your world comes…VERBAL SYMBOLS have NO meaning for us. OUR EXPERIENCE IS NOT TRANSLATABLE…WE PERCEIVE YOUR THOUGHTS AS LIGHTS…It is nearly impossible for US to explain our reality. Know only that WE exist. WE send immeasurable vitality to you…YOU ARE NEVER ALONE.” end
Barrie Comments: So, I’m sorry but NOTHING these folks say about SETH2 or WE ARE SETH makes any sense outside of being their OWN SYMBOLS used to OBJECTIFY Seth2 as just another Seth—so that Seth IS STILL AROUND to learn from or cash in on and we are NOT alone OR on our own.
Seth2 is ANCIENT beyond infinity—Seth 2 or him or “WE” – have TAUGHT THE HUMAN RACE how to CREATE PHYSICAL REALITY in the FIRST place; how to CREATE physical objects, and so forth. Seth2 is NOT simply another Seth teacher or peer:
Seth2 (ESP Class; 7-15-69): WE want you to realize that there is consciousness without form , that there is consciousness with will and vitality that comes to you from BEYOND EVEN THOSE PLACES THAT YOUR SETH KNOWS. WE want you to realize that though it is hard for us to communicate, WE SPOKE WITH YOUR RACE BEFORE your race learned language. WE gave you mental images and upon these images you LEARNED TO FORM the world that you know.
“WE gave you the PATTERN BY WHICH YOUR PHYSICAL SELVES ARE FORMED. WE gave you the pattern by which YOU LEARNED TO FORM YOUR PHYSICAL REALITY. WE gave you the patterns intricate, involved and blessed from which YOU FORM THE REALITY OF EACH PHYSICAL THING YOU KNOW. We gave you the PATTERN upon which you FORMED your ENTIRE PHYSICAL UNIVERSE and the COMPREHENSION THAT EXISTS WITHIN EACH CELL , the knowledge that EACH CELL has, the desire for organization was given by us. The ENTIRE WEBWORK WAS INITIATED by us. WE TAUGHT YOU TO FORM THE REALITY THAT YOU KNOW.” end qt
Barrie Comments: The term “WE” is ABSOLUTELY NOTHING like the super simplified version of “WE” that we as humans and YOU routinely use. We CAN’T grasp Seth 2 at all and we CERTAINLY can’t grasp the “WE” that he refers to—which is really a consciousness energy, or energy-gestalt personality, or a “multi-dimensional personality structure” BEYOND our COMPREHENSION. They have NO bodies, never did; no gender, NOTHING HUMAN at all.
Seth II (ESP Class, 1-13-70): “YOU DO NOT UNDERSTAND MULTI-DIMENSIONAL PERSONALITY STRUCTURES.
SethII (ESP Class; 7-15-69): “There is consciousness with will and vitality that comes to you from BEYOND EVEN THOSE PLACES THAT YOUR SETH KNOWS.”
Barrie Comments: And now…voila…Jane DIED and Seth is NOW Seth2? The next Seth on the team who has WAITED to step forward? Or Seth is NOW some new, alternate Seth; and it took 1-36 linear earth years for an ancient personality like Seth to SUDDENLY “evolve?” And on TOP of that, he no longer cares about the integrity and authenticity of his material? And now the whole Seth family has been awakened from its slumber?
Seth2 (ESP Class,10-14-69): “We sent him (Seth) to you in YOUR terms in some INDESCRIBABLY DISTANT PAST. He entered your universe in a reality I find difficult to remember. He gave guidance to your kind FOR EONS OF YOUR TIME. I do not sufficiently understand the experience in which you are presently involved, in your terms.”
Barrie Comments: As I said, some have referred to all of these “Seths” as a FAMILY of Seths—like one of our earth families—whose members have apparently just WAITED for Jane to die before ALL of them could finally come forward to communicate with ANYONE who asks. WHY would Jane have to die first? This “family” must have ALWAYS been around, right? OR did it ONLY start in 1963 when Jane first started with Seth or only after JANE’S death in 1984?
In MY opinion, overlooking the potential financial windfall of USING Seth’s name, there is ALSO a narcissistic or myopic perspective existing with these “alternate” Seth folks or their followers that dictates to them that Seth operates on THEIR linear needs and linear time.
BUT Seth2 IS an energy, or multi-dimensional personality structure, SO TOTALLY beyond our limited, human understanding. Those folks DON’T realize this–proudly claim that “THEIR” Seth is NOT Jane’s Seth but Seth2. They so desperately hold on to A Seth, or ANY Seth, because EACH believe they SO NEED a Seth; or for themselves or financial reward…or BOTH.
When people like Ron and others claim with ALL sincerity or not—that ANYONE in a dream or alternate state can contact an expanded or family-member Seth just for the asking—they do not seem to realize that these are their SUBJECTIVE dream BELIEFS. Seth has become their SYMBOL-seen-as-fact because they won’t, don’t or CAN’T see “THEIR Seth” as a symbol.
Seth (ESP Class, 3-12-74): Class Member: “Seth, would you help me in my DREAMS if I tried to contact you?”
Seth Responds: “You help yourself in your OWN DREAMS. You do not need me. You may use the SYMBOL of me, but when you do, it is a SYMBOL of your own inner knowledge, for I am the SYMBOL of the knowledge that dwells within each of your psyches. I am MYSELF, but beyond that I am the SYMBOL OF THE KNOWLEDGE THAT DWELLS WITHIN EACH OF YOUR PSYCHES.”
I’ll “let” Seth have the final word in closing:
Seth (Deleted Session, 7-2-77): “(These people) distrust themselves…they use MY position as a substitute for the AUTHORITY they are trying to give up. They think, “IF I HAD A SETH, I too would progress,” and so forth…
Barrie, I had a source, of enlightenment in Miami in 1962, that corroborated my later learned Seth material beginning when I read Seth Speaks in 1974. I was contacted in Feb of 1962 by a highly advanced being from another reality who intent was to give me straight answers as to why I was observing many UFOs over Miami, day and night, but could not get answers from the usual sources, like parents, friends, relatives and teachers, so the space people decided to contact me, at age 17/18 and this being, who was non-physical in his world, thought a body into physical being from which to comfortably relate to me, and he told me that he had physical incarnations in Atlantis and ancient India as well a other planets, but no longer had need for physical expression. My first questions to “him” was, who are you, where did you come from, do you believe in God, where is God, is there a devil, a heaven, a hell, what happens to me when i die, what is the purpose of life on earth, stuff like that, and he spent nearly a year explaining the REAL answers to my probing questions, and, amazingly, later after reading Seth Speaks in 1974, my space friend gave me nearly exact Seth-type information, confirming what Seth came out with, so I personally had an ET touchstone to the Seth material. I never went public with my story because I have no interest in the UFO weirdo craze, and I used both the Seth material and my space friend’s material to better my life and create and attract abundance in many forms and I can look back upon an abundantly filled and successful life. My wife, Linda, introduced me to Seth in 1974 from a friend who mailed her a copy of Seth Speaks, so, Barrie, for the past 47 years, Linda and I have been a most successful and creative Sethian husband – wife team, and we became capitalist entrepreneurs starting a super successful Virginia statewide souvenir post card business which we operated for 25 years, from 1975 to 2000, when a customer approached us to buy us out for cash, so we sold our business and retired in our 50s as multi-millionaires, thanks to the Seth material. So Seth works well for us. Oh, before we married, Linda and I both had cushy Miami civil service jobs, 9 to 5, but we wanted more. It appears that two Sethian heads are better than one, LOL. – ron
Ron speaks on Seth’s BEHALF, which Seth encourages, only Seth speaks for himself, you misunderstand me. Seth said that when the student is ready that he will inspire him or her. – ron
Seth: “I do not need permission to speak.”
Ron: “I do not need permission to speak.”
Any questions?
I think I know you both from some probable-lives. Maybe those generated some years ago when I considered relocating to the East Coast, but after considering the hurricanes, and the summer bugs I changed my mind.
2 Likes
Barrie, you simply miss the point of all your “cut and paste”, and that is Seth meant what he said ONLY WHILE JANE WAS ALIVE. Seth revealed while he was working with Jane he was also working with other personalities in other realities, as he always had and always will. – ron